Twenty Years

Deti recently stated,

Like I have said, I know a lot, A LOT, of men like this. Men who should be absolutely doing great with women. They have, they are, everything these girls say they want. These aren’t dudebros fresh out of school living in 100-year old houses with six other roommates and working at BigBoxRetailStore as the night stock crew. These aren’t dickbag deadbeats with no steady income.

They look good, in good shape, dress well. They have educations and jobs; some have advanced degrees and work in the traditional professions. They have money. They have places of their own (some even own their own houses), tastefully and appropriately furnished. They have their own cars and They aren’t video-game playing basement dwellers. They aren’t idiots, creeps, freaks, or weirdos. They suffer from no mental disorders of which I’m aware and have no glaring physical deformities. One has a receding hairline.

And yet, these guys can’t generate ANY Interest. At all. None. They don’t lament about it; they just sort of accept it. It’s “just how it is, man.” Most of them have resigned themselves to living life without marriage, ever; and even if they do marry, they have sworn off kids.

I just cannot be the only guy in the whole world who’s seeing this among younger men, 22-35.

Ton seconded this,

I agree with Deti about the quality of men who are over looked by women. 20+ years ago, the mgtow I know today would have done all right in the smp. Not killed it but ok. Now? Not so much.

So here is the question: “What factors, and by how much, have led to this?”  Here are some possibilities, not necessarily mutually exclusive,

1.  Reality TV / Kardashians / Hannah Montana / Sex and the City / Snooki / slut culture has taken its toll

2.  Women are more inclined to ride the carousel

3.  Women just want to have fun in their twenties, more than they used to

4.  The upcoming generation’s parents were less capable than previous generations

5.  “Entitlement Culture” has built such a level of acceptance that there is no challenge to it

6.  Facebook / texting / internet

7.  Schools have become even more politically correct in what they do and what they teach

8.  Space aliens control young women

You decide.

Posted in FarmBoy, Feminism, Lies
138 comments on “Twenty Years
  1. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    It’s really good that these guys can put such a good face on it.
    What I think is happeneing is that the female collective is playing “chicken” with hypergamy. They have raised the bar so high that young men are walking away. The marginal men won’t be noticed but, this is discouraging all men, including the ones they desire.
    For those that don’t know what playing “chicken” is


  2. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    I think that social media, Tindr, et al. are behind a lot of this “raising the bar”. What I think will happen is that it’ll end like musical chairs. When a the music stops, a lot of them won’t find a seat. I would bet that a lot of these women are in some kind of rotation.


  3. Yoda says:

    Perhaps online dating fueled hypergamy it has


  4. Yoda says:

    What I think is happeneing is that the female collective is playing “chicken” with hypergamy.

    Most realize this not.
    Emergent behavior it is.


  5. Sumo says:

    Space aliens control young women

    Hey now, don’t go blaming this shite on innocent aliens.

    Liked by 4 people

  6. Yoda says:

    Space aliens control young women

    True this is not.
    If we did, better they would behave.
    For embarrassment to all intelligent life forms these women are.

    Liked by 3 people

  7. Cill says:

    “What factors, and by how much, have led to this?”

    Two factors:
    1. Group bias
    2. The State taking over the roles of men as providers for, and protectors of, mothers and their children.

    Group bias comes first. Women have it; men don’t. Because they lack group bias, men could never concoct a grotesque anti-female ideology and sick it onto women and girls like a mad dog.

    Because they have group bias in spades, women did concoct Feminism and sick it onto men and boys like a mad dog.

    Feminism is deeply embedded in Western institutions. It infiltrates bureaucracy and the MSM. It highjacks education and intimidates governments. Governments are Feminism’s bitch.

    The intrinsic factor is female group bias, which is older than humanity itself. The rest of the entire sick business follows as a matter of course. The State takes the tax men pay, and uses it to undermine and replace them. The State makes it possible for women to thumb their noses at good men, while education, the legal system and the MSM encourage women to treat men as irrelevant losers. The thing that has astonished me most is how naturally and easily women took to their role of diminishing their husbands and sons.

    Goes without saying, Liz and co. here are evidence that not all women are group-biased. But the overwhelming majority of the women out there are group-biased to hell.

    Liked by 9 people

  8. Yoda says:

    Hey now, don’t go blaming this shite on innocent aliens.

    Perhaps blame Canada we should

    Liked by 2 people

  9. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    Under Yoda’s control good this would be.
    Make sandwiches faster than padawans could eat.
    Padawans complaint new-too much food.


  10. Yoda says:

    Group bias comes first. Women have it; men don’t. Because they lack group bias, men could never concoct a grotesque anti-female ideology and sick it onto women and girls like a mad dog.

    Because they have group bias in spades, women did concoct Feminism and sick it onto men and boys like a mad dog.

    Says much this does.
    Everything else a symptom it is?

    Liked by 1 person

  11. Yoda says:

    Under Yoda’s control good this would be.

    Use Jedi mind tricks on all of Earth’s women one cannot.
    Go crazy one would.
    Notice that Jedi only use mind tricks on males you should.
    A good reason for this there is.

    Liked by 1 person

  12. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    Awesome comment!

    Yoda at 3:20am,
    I would say that internet dating has had a lot to do with it. With a five percent response rate, guys are going to copy and paste introduction messages like crazy. The girls are going to believe that all this attention is for they alone. OOPS!

    Liked by 2 people

  13. Cill says:

    “Everything else a symptom it is?”
    Yoda, I sincerely do think it is so.


  14. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    Jedi mind tricks work only on ordered minds?

    According to TurdFlingingMonkey on youtube, the only way to turn society away from gynocentrism fo patriarchy is to kill a significant number of the men in war. Women have to compete, not cooperate.
    Perhaps, if enough men go MGTOW, the effect can be duplicated.

    Liked by 3 people

  15. SFC Ton says:

    I reckon the main reason why is women have become even more divorced from reality. Its all of that stuff folks listed and more combined with the inherent and unpleasant reality of women’s biological programming , each doing a small part, the results being damage much greater then any one contributing factor

    Liked by 1 person

  16. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    If the SMP/MMP is a market like any other, it can have a bubble.
    I hope this is what I am seeing. If it gets worse for men or, even if it maintains, it’ll be more than most men will tolerate.
    This thing has to crash.

    Liked by 1 person

  17. Cill says:

    “This thing has to crash.”

    It is crashing.

    Cill into Yodish lapses he does:

    On being the social workshop of the world NZ foolishly prides itself it does.
    To write an update on the PPPs for months the niggling urge I have had.
    But much time-consuming in-person IRL research it takes.
    Run out of steam I quickly will do.

    Liked by 1 person

  18. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    You and the PPPs don’t mix too well. Perhaps a second hand report?

    Liked by 2 people

  19. Cill says:

    Perhaps Fuzzy could consider the PPPs in the interests of research to pork?


  20. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    They wouldn’t be too happy with me. I want long term and they are very short term.
    We can’t ask Choicy to volunteer again.

    Liked by 1 person

  21. Spawny Get says:

    Choicy’s research into PPPs was very informative. Informative and depressing.
    Do they turn to drugs and cats when the empowering shag like a man becomes empty, even to women lacking introspection on a spectacular scale as they do?


  22. Cill says:

    Hoy Spawny you ok mate??
    [SG – Yeah. Bit of a potentially momentous day today. But yeah, I’m fine. I do wonder if my new domain’s emails are getting spam filtered (are spam filters .space phobic?). I’m getting suspiciously few responses to the emails (to you and others). Can you check your spam filter? Other than that, slip us an email, mate ]

    Liked by 1 person

  23. SFC Ton says:

    This thing has to crash…… says who? & it could crash or simply be replaced over time as the West is demographically replaced or turned into some weird version of Brazil or who the hell knows what.

    Seems to me the this has to crash reasoning is probably just as much a rationalization on doing nothing as it is an actual prediction


  24. Spawny Get says:

    Ton, you’re right to wonder if it’s wishful thinking, you could be right. But as the years go by, I do think there’s a rising backlash against the toxic ‘ism’s. I don’t know what happens over various social issues, I think there’s immense scope for claret. But I would appreciate that that conversation doesn’t take place here. Because the language gets excitable in those conversations and it’s very easy to make everybody look like nutjobs. That could be inconvenient. And I’m not hungry for the zombie apocalypse, I’m just curious as to how we avoid it given the political leaders that we all have. Cankles4Prez is worse than any of those over here, but I’m not sure what options you have that are hugely better. Wavey-Davey is fucking useless, but at least he’s not actively looking to make things worse.

    Liked by 1 person

  25. Liz says:

    I still haven’t set up my account, Swithy…will do later this week.
    My brother’s coming to visit with his kids today and Mike has been out on the boat. 🙂

    Per the crash, well…people have been waiting for that for a long time. I was certain that the first Clinton would ruin us but although the policies and precedents he made HAVE set us on a course for ruin it is taking far longer than I expected. Mike, the optimist, would point to the type of crap that went down in the 60s and 70s and say times are better.

    “Cankles4Prez” LOL! I love it. 😀


  26. Yoda says:

    Jedi mind tricks work only on ordered minds?

    Unordered minds make Jedi crazy they do.


  27. Spawny Get says:

    “Unordered minds make Jedi crazy they do.”
    Finally we hear the excuse reason.

    BTW are you aware that you have a new email address allowing you to easily set up an avatar for Yoda? Have you checked your spam accounts?


  28. Yoda says:

    Check I will

    Liked by 1 person

  29. missattempts says:

    A combination of being “spoiled,” media brainwashing, cowardice, (Not taking risks.)
    and settling down to half-lives.
    Why aren’t people trying to make a go of it in Hollywood? Why aren’t they on
    Broadway in plays such as “Gypsy” and “West Side Story?”


  30. Yoda says:

    the results being damage much greater then any one contributing factor

    An anti-synergism it would be.
    These should be avoided at all costs.
    Instead, actively encourage the we do.


  31. Yoda says:

    “Them” it should be


  32. BuenaVista says:

    Just another field report illustrating the obvious.

    Last night I listened (for two hours) to the tales of woe of a woman who shudders at the reality that her dream may not come true. The outline is familiar to all of us, so trite I could be accused of pandering or narrative spinning. It was pathetic and familiar; I opened a few bottles of wine to get through it.


    a. is a senior NGO manager, and travels to exotic locales around the world to “enhance” electoral processes. Next job: Burma.

    b. is 37.

    c. is never-married.

    d. has a MASTERS DEGREE YAY!

    e. has a big rack and wears revealing blouses.

    f. doesn’t own her apartment and in fact is worried because her roommate is leaving; i.e., she lives paycheck to paycheck despite being a professional, middle-aged, and single.

    g. can’t figure out why her 55 year-old boyfriend (whom I know vaguely; he’s a fit, Washington political pundit with a great home) went ghost on her after four months. All she did was say, ARE WE GOING TO GET MARRIED OR NOT!

    h. can’t figure out why it was a bad idea to have drinks with me and my date (her girlfriend) for two hours and then go over to former boyfriend’s house for dinner and jacuzzi.

    i. came onto me at a mixer once, while my date (her girlfriend) was in the room.

    j. giggled when I invited her to spend the night with my date and me once.

    k. talked about two things for two hours last night: her troubles with her ex-boyfriend, who freaked out when she put the hammer down after four months; and which expensive exotic locale she should visit with my date in July (when travel costs are at their zenith). Note: this is a woman who doesn’t own a home despite not having any dependents or college loans, after working for 15 years, and is worried about how she’ll make the rent after her roommate leaves. But, Corsica.

    Okay, she doesn’t understand. She’s been doing the sex-tour thing for 15 years, her career is a phony, tax-funded moral narcissism thing, she’s got a negative net worth, she’s 37 and she’s running out of eggs, her face is a pleasant six, her body is a labored six (she’ll be huge before long), and Mr. Right Now won’t fall on his sword and marry her because she fucked him for a couple of months. (Mr. Right Now is probably saying, “I barely recovered from the last divorce, and this chick wants half of my duplex condo, because we had some laughs for a few months.”


    My take is straightforward. Deti and Ton’s cohort of responsible men have no market for their SMP wares because the girls in that cohort believe the bullshit that the party never ends; it just restarts at the appropriate time with a guy who has a balance sheet, shoulders, infinite patience for feminine patter, and a member that causes them to say during missionary that “It feels like it’s all the way up in my throat.” Women often confuse silence with acceptance, or confusion. The silence of the deltas who are invisible to women at 29? That’s the silence of self-awareness and social sophistication.

    The reality is more like the “very successful” NGO gurrrl above. She’s broke, one month from being evicted, two years from hitting her sell-buy date, unable to contemplate July without a week in a travel-hero destination. In five years her magnificent breasts will be around her waist. As I opened, a manosphere cliche. But this all happened last night. Not a single detail invented. In fact, I read to the girls a short story by James Salter, illustrative of about 25 red pill truths, and if I gave you their response to that, this post would make your brain explode. (Salter, America’s finest stylist of the past 50 years, combat fighter pilot, screenwriter for Downhill Racer (which made Redford) and my literary hero and former neighbor, died last week.)


    Oh. And incidentally, I asked her, after she stopped crying at one point, if she ever considered going out with guys who didn’t write for magazines or work for the government or prosecute social justice or all the rest of it. Both she and my date (not exaggerating) were stunned. What the fuck did I mean?

    “You know, what about a guy who owns five health clubs and has a house on the Outer Banks. What about a guy who has five crews framing houses and likes to fish on his old Bertram. Those kind of guys.”

    “Oh, I don’t have anything in common with them.”

    “But you might have desire for them.”

    “I can’t imagine.”

    “Wouldn’t you rather be married to someone you desire sexually?”

    “I’m so over that.”

    So we have a desperate woman who hit the wall three years ago in a state of panic who can’t properly fund her own old age who just wants to be a SAHM mom, not that that means she’s going to do housework mind you that’s so patriarchal, and the idea of being with a man who doesn’t get invited to the White House Correspondents Dinner is beyond the pale.

    If I sent her a text now saying, “I just want to get married to an innocent girl with smarts like you and I think we have a lot in common” I would be doing the hurly-burly on her no-doubt crappy sofa in 25 minutes. Young men being ignored by such women have the right idea.

    Liked by 3 people

  33. Spawny Get says:

    Should have been a post, BV.

    “In fact, I read to the girls a short story by James Salter, illustrative of about 25 red pill truths, and if I gave you their response to that, this post would make your brain explode. ”
    this needs to be the follow-up post

    I would truly love to understand what is going on in the minds of these women, I really would.

    We have a lot of public sector employees on gold plated, final salary schemes into which they have contributed very little, all expecting the pensions to be there when the financial sector collapses. The money isn’t there to pay them, it’s an entire Ponzi scheme from top to bottom. And PFI deals that mean that we are paying hugely over the odds for hospitals, schools etc and will do so for 30 years…meaning NHS budgets are strained beyond reason already with no ability to control costs in the future. These people are going to break mentally when it all goes away because it’s all based on bubbles. The banker types have stolen the world. This doesn’t get to end well.


  34. Cill says:

    Spawny mate, I’ve just sent you an email. If you haven’t received it could you let me know here?


  35. Yoda says:

    is a senior NGO manager, and travels to exotic locales around the world to “enhance” electoral processes.

    her career is a phony, tax-funded moral narcissism thing

    Sounds like Coruscant right before Palpatine it does.


  36. Spawny Get says:

    Hi Cill, yes I have an email. Cheers. Check yours 😉


  37. Yoda says:

    Doing actual good cares little for she does.
    Feeling good about supposedly doing good cares for much she would.


  38. Yoda says:

    BV write post he should.

    Liked by 2 people

  39. Spawny Get says:

    Our ‘civil service’ is 2:1 female:male. But even worse than that when you look at the waste of space jobs. Whenever cuts in such jobs are mentioned we hear the ‘women hit hardest’ whining. I swear these people have no idea what austerity is. They’re already marching over it, but there’s nothing worthy of the name going on. They have no fcuking idea of what will happen if the country’s bankruptcy is recognised…we’re already bankrupt, we’re just waiting for the axe. Just like Greece

    Liked by 1 person

  40. Yoda says:

    Not all that she thinks she is she would be.


  41. Yoda says:

    we hear the ‘women hit hardest’ whining

    Modernized headline this would be.

    “British Launch Somme Offensive
    Women Hardest Hit”

    Liked by 3 people

  42. Cill says:

    Yeah FB and Spawny have been holding the fort on posts. I admit to being a lazy bastard. I prefer to comment on someone else’s post. I’m a wart. A pimple. A blackhead. A mole. Or maybe it’s just because my own posts bore the shit out of me. Whatever. Some day FB might get tired of holding the fort and then where will we be?

    Anyway, back to business. Right now I have an email to send to Spawny.


  43. Liz says:

    You listened to that for 2 HOURS BV?
    You’re made of really strong stuff.
    But, I guess it probably provided some fascinating entertainment.
    In a comedy noir way.

    Liked by 3 people

  44. Cill says:

    Battle of the Bulge
    Pregnant women hardest hit.

    Liked by 1 person

  45. theasdgamer says:

    “Wouldn’t you rather be married to someone you desire sexually?”

    “I’m so over that.”

    I see this a lot from the post-menopausal set, including Mrs. Gamer, “I don’ need no steenkeeng sex!”

    A couple of hours later she is moaning her lungs out. lolz. These women are so living In The Moment ™. They are unaware of what they might be feeling in a different set of circumstances. They all want a man’s attention and to be the object of an attractive man’s desire, even when they don’t currently feel the need for sex (because their T-level is low and no attractive man is currently instigating for sex).


  46. Spawny Get says:

    Farm Boy has held the fort. I’ve just managed to butt (i.e. play an arse) in from time to time.

    Liked by 1 person

  47. thedeti says:

    Thanks, FarmBoy.

    That comment of mine resonated a bit.

    I think what is going to happen is that you’re going to see a wider chasm between two different kinds of men. Sexual haves, and sexual have nots.

    Of the men I had in mind when I wrote the comment, the men I was describing, they will all adapt.

    Many will try their hand at being players. A few will succeed, I think.

    Most will go their own way. A few of them will be lost in perpetual bitterness. Most of this cohort will eventually make their peace with it, and resign themselves to… slowing down at work at around 54, retirement at 60 or earlier, no children, no wife, and doing whatever they want until they slip into eternity.

    Liked by 2 people

  48. Cill says:

    “I’ve just managed to butt (i.e. play an arse) in from time to time.”
    I had no choice but to Like on that one, affable, agreeable, yes-man that I am. 😉

    Liked by 1 person

  49. poseidon740 says:

    @ deti:

    Scary for those of us who have sons. Now that my son is 15 years of age he is maturing and getting more and more receptive to our conversations about life. At this point in time he says he does want a child, but does not want to get married. He knows those two have limited congruence, but he has time to figure it out, or not figure it out. But he is aware, unlike young men of my generation (babyboomer).


  50. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    I have to wonder how many there are aout there like this woman. I’ll bet it is not insignificant.

    Spawny Get,
    Wih a male to female ratio of two to ne in government work the fembots have the audacity to to claim that women are being targeted for layoffs?

    I can see that happening with overlooked men, easily. I just have to wonder if the woman that BV describes and her collegues will raise hell about not finding husbands. Will postmenupausal spinsters get sympathy?


  51. Spawny Get says:

    Fuzzie, yeah. They’ll try it on to get layoffs of equal numbers or some such shit. Even though they outnumber men. And even though men do the men’s work that needs doing. It’ll work too, betcha


  52. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    Spawny Get,
    That’s cold. I an not sure how or if men can respond to that.

    Liked by 1 person

  53. thedeti says:

    As I think about it more, I have to wonder about declining marriage. Change happens slowly. A lot of men are going to be so goddamn thirsty they’ll be willing to wife up an aging woman if it means the (albeit likely unfulfilled and short lived) promise of sex.

    I have no doubt BV’s aging buxom friend will get wifed up. She’ll get desperate enough, and some man out there will be thirsty enough. Postmenopausal spinsters will still be able to get married. And they’ll get sympathy, mostly in the form of government subsidies.

    I don’t know about Poseidon’s 15 year old son. Fascinating that at 15 he knows he wants to be a father; yet doesn’t want to marry. I hope Poseidon will give it time. Much will change with his boy in 10 to 15 years, when he gets to his late 20s. I think that if young Poseidon Jr. gives it time, he will go into the SMP with a much clearer idea of what he can reasonably accomplish.

    Liked by 2 people

  54. Spawny Get says:

    Although conditions were better when I was younger, i was clueless. Hopefully better knowledge by the kids will tip things back towards them a little? I have good thoughts for my younger red pill brothers

    Liked by 1 person

  55. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    I think, that as the years pile on, it will be more difficult for aging spinsters to marry. Granted, men will be horny, but, there is a limit to how effective that is. Attraction has to be balanced against risk and there are too many downsides that are certain.

    Liked by 1 person

  56. Cill says:

    I’ve said this before, but I’ll say it again because I think it’s important that you jokers know this blog is not just a lot of hot air. Under a long-standing arrangement, groups of young men have visited me regularly and we discuss printouts of posts and comments from this blog. For a comment on Francis’ blog I counted the number of them who are MGTOW as a result. There are more than 40 actually. It’s not something I keep written records of.

    Liked by 3 people

  57. poseidon740 says:

    @ the deti:

    “I think that if young Poseidon Jr. gives it time, he will go into the SMP with a much clearer idea of what he can reasonably accomplish.”

    For my son it is not an attraction issue. His SMP shall be quite sufficient. He is half my genetic composition. What he is expressing is reflectant of what he discusses with his buddies online, what he has heard from his mother, and what he has ascertained from me. I have introduced him to smidgets of Dalrock’s and Empath’s blogs as well as explaining to him limited bits of our man-hating culture. He is very intelligent, strong abstract cognition, and is learning critical thinking.

    As I tell him, I would prefer him to find a “nice girl” to marry and have children with. I explained to him that the best life style is marriage when both man and wife are respectful and loving to each other. But with the other realities I explained along with the aforementioned, he currently is apprehensive about marriage. His hormones will kick in and he will reconsider……..

    Being his dad is the best experience life can offer. My son and my faith……

    Liked by 3 people

  58. Farm Boy says:

    There is a new post.


  59. Spawny Get says:

    Cill, do they want to write a post?

    This blog isn’t about Thou Shalt GYOW. As long as the intent is to help men by bouncing around ideas that address the world as it actually is…go for it.

    I’d be very interested to hear what the darn whippersnappers’ experiences and thoughts are.

    How do girls turn into PPPs?

    Do the youngsters mind girls with high N for serious relationships? As opposed to a PPP genitals that pass in the night? The femeroids intend to force men to accept it by turning every girl they can into a ‘slut’. Hence the desperate slug walks to try and detoxify the word. Never going to happen, I reckon, but I’m interested in what the youngsters think. There’s no right or wrong answer, what do they think? Higher N for the woman correlates with increased divorce/breakup risk in my generation (according to stats)…anyone think that’s going to change?


  60. Cill says:

    “Cill, do they want to write a post?”
    That’s an interesting thought. I don’t think any of them would want to write one on his own but they might enjoy it as a group effort. All of them are under-privileged, under-educated children of neglectful solo mums, which is the reason these boys became “problem young men” in the first place. Any post by them would almost certainly end up being written by me but I could use their opinions and ideas.

    Anyway, next time they’re here I’ll find out what they think about doing a post. Thanks mate. Good suggestion.

    Liked by 1 person

  61. Farm Boy says:

    Spawny suggests that they comment on the next post

    Liked by 1 person

  62. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    What may be best is to ask a bunch of prepared questions, get teir reactions, and put it to paper. This is a great idea!


  63. Yoda says:

    Bear earned much food he has


  64. Cill says:

    Fuzzy, good idea. Could you help me with prepared questions to ask? I really could do with some help with this. Maybe we could continue this on FB’s latest post (Plan For a Brighter Tomorrow)

    Liked by 1 person

  65. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    I just remembered the expression that I had been searching for in the recesses of my memory. “Leftover women” This was used to describe womenj in China that live in major metros who’s hypergamy has gone so far, they can’t find men fit to marry. I think, for the most part, they are office ladies.
    This concept applies to BV’s example in spades. Hr 55 yo boyfriend is not going to marry, having been down that road and finally recovering.
    In the future, there are going to be a lot of “leftover women” out there.


  66. SFC Ton says:

    My son is unlikely to marry. Not that his experiences in the SMP are horrible, they are a mixed bag, but he has seen to much and learned to much about women. His he generation of young men might not be hardcore red pillers, but they have seen the gender wars play out in ways I had not at his age. He is 23. Knows what his mother did, despises both grandmothers and knows all about military spouses. Hard to come back from that

    I will disagree with Deti. She seems to high on herself to step down fast enough to be wifed up. By the time she starts slumming it she won’t be able to land the “lesser” men she now rejects.

    Liked by 1 person

  67. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    SFC Ton,
    I am sorry to hear that about your son and, it is no consolation that he is not alone. It’s like something has been stolen from them.

    Liked by 1 person

  68. Yoda says:

    I will disagree with Deti. She seems to high on herself to step down fast enough to be wifed up. By the time she starts slumming it she won’t be able to land the “lesser” men she now rejects.

    Thinking this I was.
    No real evidence of reality sinking in.

    Liked by 1 person

  69. SFC Ton says:

    Why be sorry Fuzzie? He is putting together a good life for himself. I was passed he didn’t expat, but he has a good game plan and should be good to go

    Liked by 1 person

  70. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    SFC Ton,
    I am sorry. Not that I can do anything about it. In this SMP?MMP, he got cheated out of a fair shot. I wish that I knew where to lay the blame. Certaionly, not on him.


  71. SFC Ton says:

    Whatever “good thing” he was cheated out of is only one thing; all the guys out there who said they wish they knew xyz @ 23, well he is 23 & knows xyz. He is in a good as place as a 23 year old man can reasonably expect to be

    Liked by 2 people

  72. SFC Ton says:

    So want that post you don’t want written here, want to write it for my place?


  73. Spawny Get says:

    I don’t know whether there’s anything new to say, I’m not sure that you’ve much persuading to do, either. I certainly bow to your knowledge of how shit life is going to be afterwards because you’ve been ‘back to the future’. There’s no such thing as a bug out location here unless you’re very, very wealthy indeed. Too small a country, too big a population and it’s growing relentlessly.


  74. BuenaVista says:

    I also disagree with Deti. There’s no evidence she understands why she is 0 for 238 with men, and incredulity met my suggestion she change her approach. Women in this group believe Sheryl Sandberg, not their own eyes, or their own diaries. They are wedded to their own sense of entitlement to be honored and cherished for the things they honor and cherish in themselves, including their delusions.

    Liked by 1 person

  75. SFC Ton says:

    Spawny, I think the biggest things that will shock people are
    How bad it get and how fast it gets bad.
    How tribal things get be with your own kind. If you are NAM, you still want to be around White folks, but you want to be a very small minority like under 3%

    People struggle to keep their illusions about people and the world. Don’t do that. It potentially deadly in a myriad of ways.


  76. Spawny Get says:

    it’s a sort of Evila Knieval
    You have to admire the self belief, but you have to ask if it’s being put to good use. And whether it’ll turn out well


  77. @ ton I would like to read a post on what you have to say about that.

    Liked by 1 person

  78. BuenaVista says:

    In a very real sense we already live in a tribal world; the military and the nation-state are supplanted by tribal loyalties, and tribal loyalties render the endless chattering of politicians and generals hollow. This slowly emerging insight penetrates even The World’s Sole Remaining Superpower ™.

    An example: a senior State Department mandarin asked me my opinion as to what happens next in Baghdad. N.B.: these people had no interest in what I have to say a year ago.

    “Seriously?” I said?

    “Do you really think it will burn?”

    “If the Iranians don’t save it, yes. Have you looked at how its encircled? It’s fucking Vicksburg.”


    “Grant strangled Vicksburg. Then he killed it.”

    The absurdity of nation-state pretensions is illustrated: the FDA (our Food and Drug Administration, the bureaucracy that controls drug approvals and tobacco suppression, etc.) has a few hundred people in the Green Zone in Baghdad. There remain several thousand U.S. civilians in the Green Zone, doing their departmental bidding. They’re going to need a lot of Chinooks, soon, absent our friends the Iranians choosing to save the city. This post should be read with the irony meter redlined.

    Liked by 1 person

  79. BuenaVista says:

    Spawny, I think the best way to look at NGO Gurrrl is the biological phenomenon known as the extinction burst.

    In an extinction burst, the amoeba is under assault and expires in reflexive spasms of unthinking self-sabotaging self-violence. It doesn’t learn or adapt. It just goes out quickly and spasmodically, all evidence of futility notwithstanding.

    A good example of the extinction burst in human behavior everyone will understand: imagine a frustrated, blinded salesman who just fucked up another sales call. He stands at the elevator, enraged that he has to wait for his ride. The elevator is called. He stands at the door, punching the button furiously as though it makes any sense at all.

    NGO Gurrrl will keeping punching her elevator button. Fifteen years of futility has taught her nothing, nor even suggested to her she should learn something. Blue Pill in divorce, I note, I did the same thing. I doubled down on what obviously wasn’t working.

    “Time to die,” replicant Rutger Hauer says, having exhausted his energies in his own extinction burst, as he slumps to a rooftop bed of tar and trash, done.

    Liked by 2 people

  80. Bv, that extinction burst passage… Among your finest yet! Bravo!!!

    And three cheers for Farm Boy, daily posts to keep the discussion rolling along. That’s no small feat! 🙂

    Liked by 1 person

  81. BuenaVista says:

    On the delusions of NGO Gurrrl:

    Saturday my hostess took me to her health club, one of those incredible places where the beautiful and gay pay $110 per month to exercise with every known technology known to man. Hostess took her high-intensity class with three other women and a gay guy. My workout involves 15 minutes of trying to loosen up two surgical shoulders, some rolling around on the floor doing bizarre and effective stretching to loosen up the torso and two legs with traumatic neuropathies. The music pounds and it’s time to hit the squat rack, no machines for me. I’m into barbell and composite lifts now. Hostess is one in 45; I’m not even started on upper body by then.

    In my hostess’s class was an absolutely stunning Scandinavian with a Barbie Doll figure, including an ass that one could bounce a dime off.

    My hostess and Barbie completed their class and headed out to the Farmer’s Market. First I was introduced to Barbie, in her skin-tight outfit, while I was dripping sweat to the floor and doing sets of medicine ball slams and farmer carries.

    So, two observations: Barbie knew I was with Hostess. I looked like shit, being hung-over, unshaven, my gray t-shirt dark with sweat. I probably have 25 years on her.

    45 minutes later I was done, and was walking slowly up the hill to Hostess’s place. I’m limping because deadlifts do some weird shit to one leg that causes it to function like a polio victim’s. Down the hill came Barbie, now alone, still wearing her sprayed-on outfit, only now with facial make-up applied. She looked better than Cameron Diaz in Kill Bill.

    As we approached each other she smirked. I said, “Hey, Hannah, enjoy the day.” “I am!” she said, slapping me on the arm.

    Ideology has taught NGO Gurrrl that she has the inherent sexual value of Barbie Hannah. So NGO Gurrrl can’t figure out why she needs to adapt to the fact that she is a 6 (and probably a 4 or 5 to men her own age), Barbie Hannah is a 9+. Barbie Hannah is the sort of woman who sinks ships and ruins domestic arrangements — and she knows it; NGO Gurrrl is the clerk who sells tickets to those ships. The gulf between these two examples of feminine value is extraordinary.

    But NGO Gurrrl doesn’t know that. While both women will flirt with Hostess’ date, only one of them has The Power. I don’t see NGO Gurrrl facing the unpleasant reality that she is spoiled milk.

    Liked by 1 person

  82. @ bv that is an interesting point. Yesterday I had a similar moment. The disgruntled sahm was here, we were talking about you guys on the blog, life, red pill, her failing marriage. As I described Ton I could literally see the tingles take hold! She wanted to hear more, said she wouldn’t mind being a poly wife, etc. as she sat there, eyes all aglow, I did not have the heart to tell her that as an overweight 37 yo who is quite honestly and not to be mean, a 4 at best, that she was about 3 points below Ton’s floor. No concept at all of her true smp! None!

    Liked by 1 person

  83. BuenaVista says:

    Bloom, and that’s before we move from mere physical appearance to the personal qualities, and biography, that make women (or men) a decent bet in an LTR. For many men the latter are more important than the former, at least if continuity and nightly peace are objectives.

    Liked by 4 people

  84. Yoda says:

    As I described Ton I could literally see the tingles take hold! She wanted to hear more, said she wouldn’t mind being a poly wife, etc. as she sat there, eyes all aglow

    Consider her children she does not.

    Liked by 2 people

  85. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    Between what BV had to say about NGO Gurll and Bloom had to say about WSAHM, I am drawing the conclusion that modern women think SMV is without meaning. That merely being female is enough to triop the levers on any man’s libido. That is vanity.

    Liked by 2 people

  86. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    There is something big going on here and I do believe that I have seen evidence of it too in real life. Modern women have no regard for for SMV rank, even if they are aware of it. All that I have seen written up on this subject is blaming thirsty guys.

    Liked by 1 person

  87. Very true Fuzzie. I have been pondering this… So this gal, her hubby is also a 4, they are evenly matched. But if in her mind she’s a prospect for a bad boy Ton babe, maybe that’s part of her problem? She thinks she “deserves better” even when she is lucky to have what she has?!?! Weird. I was shocked at the whole thing honestly, I didn’t take her for the “bad boy” type. She was practically drooling and my pointing out Ton’s (no offense!) potential drawbacks she seriously did not care???? (And Ton don’t take that personal, I think you are great, I was more trying to bring her back to reality…like he likes them early 20s, you’d get the pimp hand, he runs a tight ship, women are towing the line or on the curb, etc and she was still eating it up! :/ she kept saying “ooohhhh tell me more!” Ak!

    Liked by 1 person

  88. Yoda says:

    Eye opening experience for RPG it would seem.

    Liked by 2 people

  89. I also found myself wondering if all her nonsense is one big s#it test? Like a kid acting out, but really begging for some limits and boundaries??? Wild. It was an eye opener for sure! Maybe her hubby needs to take charge?

    Liked by 2 people

  90. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    Maybe SAHM was indulging herself in a fantasy but, I would worry too. I am very worried about her hubby. Divorce may kill him.

    One of the unstated goals of feminism was to decree all women equally attractive. In women’s minds, they may have accomplished this.

    Liked by 2 people

  91. theasdgamer says:

    my pointing out Ton’s (no offense!) potential drawbacks…I was more trying to bring her back to reality…like he likes them early 20s, you’d get the pimp hand, he runs a tight ship, women are towing the line or on the curb,

    Let’s analyze this. I don’t see any negatives from a woman’s perspective.

    Likes them early 20s…high SMV (early 20s like him too)

    you’d get the pimp hand…at last, a man who would treat me like I need to be treated when I act up

    he runs a tight ship…a leader

    women are towing the line or on the curb…he’s a leader and sets the rules and enforces them

    All good stuff from a woman’s perspective. Where are the drawbacks?

    Liked by 1 person

  92. theasdgamer says:

    Maybe her hubby needs to take charge?

    Lol, if he were a take charge type, he wouldn’t be a 4 in SMV. You could try giving him Rollo Tomassi’s “The Rational Male.”

    Liked by 2 people

  93. @ gamer I guess what surprised me most is she’s so uppity and independant, I figured she would not want a man who would check that but apparently quite the opposite. Who knew???


  94. And I know this is a shocker but apparently I am fairly niave! Lol

    Liked by 2 people

  95. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    I don’t know if hubby can turn Sahm around. First, it would be out of characte for him. Second, it would be, in the current law, abuse. The only relationship where the man is not abusive is one where the wife contols everything. She has to want to submit to him.

    Liked by 2 people

  96. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    It’s not so much naivete as being aware of a princile and then, seeing it play out in real life. There is quite a difference.


  97. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    Off topic but ominous.

    This may be more evidence of the extremes of vanity. That women are so superior that men are undeserving of civil rights.


  98. @ fuzzie well sahm is not only destroying her own happiness but her whole family’s with her fantasy based teenage thinking

    Liked by 3 people

  99. Spawny Get says:

    Move up to the challenge line drawn in the sand and stand adjacent to it. Toes touching the line.

    Liked by 1 person

  100. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    I have been thinking about SAHM and she is not going to be able to resist the temptation. It’s going to kill her virtuous, loving , loyal, hard working beta Hubby. After that, how will she be able to keep herself and her four kids together?


  101. theasdgamer says:

    I guess what surprised me most is she’s so uppity and independent

    …because hubby is submissive. She doesn’t want to be dominant, but somebody has to be.

    Liked by 1 person

  102. SFC Ton says:

    Behold the raw sexual power of the Ton! Producing tingles through second hand story telling…. though somehow I feel Bloom was trying to have me qualify myself to her……

    I have done very little in life specifically for the SMP, but I have damn sure not done these things to bang fat chicks.

    I’m pretty well aware of the smp and how things play, but rarely stop to think about how it all applies to me. Like how gamer laid out the pre selection deal but gamer is correct, it’s what they want. The worse the behavior, the more she wants the pimp hand. Women are unhappy when given free reign over their lives and unhappy when put in check but life is more peaceful when you keep them in line

    What she is doing is one big shit test. It’s what they do. The husband should fix his shit lose weight etc then tell her to fix her shit or get.

    Don’t let the kids be an emotional blackmail leverage point.

    Liked by 3 people

  103. Sumo says:

    I have done very little in life specifically for the SMP, but I have damn sure not done these things to bang fat chicks.

    Damned hillbilly……my monitor is covered in snotbeer thanks to that little quip. 😀

    Liked by 2 people

  104. @ ton and gamer I have to agree, if hubby doesn’t take charge she will derail the whole cart.

    Now this next bit may not go over well but I’d say “it’s his job” to lead his family, or to try. If she leaves, she was leaving anyway. Being in fear of what she might do only hands her the power to keep doing all this. She’s even said she WANTS him to take charge!

    This will also not be well received but think of it like that show The Dog Whisperer. Those dogs have issues because their people aren’t the lead, the dog feels unsafe and acts aggressively or whatever. Kind of the same thing.

    Fuzzie, as a friend, it might help you to start feeling your power more and focusing on women’s power less. And to ponder the origin of it?

    If her hubby does as ton says she’ll fuss, and probably pout or whatever, but then she would *settle down* and that’s what she really needs.

    As for qualifying…lol I suppose her reaction did make me wonder what I am missing about the bad boy thing! Lol. But truly Ton, I am afraid you’d put me on the curb in two weeks! 🙂

    Liked by 2 people

  105. As for me, I guess I have always thought bad boys were trouble. If someone did a pimp hand at me, I’d be terrified. I am not a sass talker to start with, naturally a pleaser anyway, so maybe the bad boy thing is too intense, seems like drama and heartbreak. Bad boys are scary! But not in a tingles way. More like next thing you know he’s traded you to someone else for a motorcycle! Lol. Who knows!

    Liked by 4 people

  106. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    Even if he does everything that can be learnt, he only has a 50/50 chance.
    A good married Christian woman blogger was once asked, “Should husbands have to ‘game’ their wives?” Her answer was no. Her attitude is her responsibility. Whatever the husband does, has limited effectiveness on her attitude.
    If you want to know what the source is, it is not her loyal, hard working husband. He can’t be that much di8ferent than the man she married. It’s the society that we live in, and the media that we consume, that are teaching women to be treacherous bitches.
    If he takes her over his knee to give her a spanking, he can go to jail and pay thousands for DV counseling.
    What you are proposing is much more easily said than done. This si Marriage 2.0


  107. Choicy says:

    Shee-it Cillo my Kiwi friend, you coined it with your comment 22 June, 2015 at 3:29 am. I printed it off and pinned it to me dunny door becuase the dunny is the only place I can sit down during the day for some quality time. If i pinned it any other door and I wouldn’t see it so it’s actually a respectful place for me to pin it, mate.

    It’s time for this digger to go out for his usual 17 hours hard slog under the desert sun, my mates. God willing I’ll see you all at the other end of my working day. Until then don’t do anything Choicy wouldn’t do, hear?

    Liked by 2 people

  108. True fuzzie, and I agree. A woman should keep herself in check. I do tell her that too, for her to focus on what *she* can control – herself!

    Liked by 2 people

  109. @ fuzzie also the dynamic for this couple may be too well set. Men who understand this stuff going in are likely more equipped to draw the lines early on and stick to it. He was young, blue pill, has a dominant mother. All bad prep for his situation now.

    Liked by 2 people

  110. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    She has a good deal and I can’t see how it can get any better.
    She found herself a good man who cares.


  111. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    Even if he is blue pill to beat the band Does not excuse her. What we discuss here is not common knowledge.
    He does need the info.

    Liked by 1 person

  112. theasdgamer says:

    Lol, Bloom, a stern look and maybe a swat on the rear in exceptional circumstances. As for trading you, I’d hold out for at least a 1962 Shelby Cobra in excellent shape. [wry smile]

    Liked by 1 person

  113. theasdgamer says:

    She is always lying, untrue, running about, ruled by emotions, a train wreck

    Too much trouble. Next!

    Liked by 1 person

  114. theasdgamer says:

    Gotta driving date with Mrs. Gamer tonight. Ciao!

    Liked by 1 person

  115. Sumo says:

    Whoa whoa whoa…..why are you wishing fat chicks upon me!? Fat chicks with kids, no less! What kind of friend are you, Bloomer?

    Liked by 3 people

  116. molly says:

    Molly’s lunchtime by golly!
    Choicy I now saw the cuz comment as well! Thanks for pointing it out, Choicy! I gave it a biiig old Like Number Nine 🙂

    I munch my lunch on my ownsome. I watch people below in the lovely sun. The aloof mizz in a smart business suit will be a PPP clubber tonight, as I know her. Huh! The snow queen will chase male tail tonight! Other mizzes I see as well. I know y’all! Ya can’t hide from the Molly lazer gaze ya piffles! >:D

    I bought extra food for Fuzzie today tho his Vista will only go and hide it.


    You can’t see y food? Then upgrade y OS, Mr Bear! Lol

    (hehe heh) I am really your good friend Molly 🙂

    Liked by 1 person

  117. molly says:

    (snort) Sumo and a fattie! (chuckle) (choke)
    Who’s ya daddy? Not! >:D

    Liked by 1 person

  118. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    CAn you really know what these women are up to in their spare time? That is quite a trick!

    Liked by 1 person

  119. […] BuenaVista in the comments […]


  120. molly says:

    Sorry Sumo, you never would play with a fatty eh. 🙂
    Mighty Sumos and bubble butt fatties monkeyshine not!
    No way!
    Forgive me O mighty one! (Bump our avatars foreheads together…. Grrrr…. who would win? Me the ‘armless one. Grrrr)

    Liked by 1 person

  121. Yoda says:

    A new post there is

    Liked by 1 person

  122. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    I have to apologize. I am late with saying thank you for the food tha Microsoft won’t let me see. WAAAAAAGGGGGGGHHHHHH!
    🌯 🌯 🌯 🐻 🙄

    Liked by 1 person

  123. molly says:

    Yeah Fuzzie I know them. Not as friends, tho I do know some of them. Like that business mizz she’s in Real Estate and I’ve done business with her. Butter wouldn’t melt in her mouth! Wot a crock! I’ve see her get trollied out of her tree. >:D

    Molly feels a mean mood toward them (PPPs) today.

    Liked by 1 person

  124. molly says:

    Back to work I go! Bye!

    Liked by 1 person

  125. @ Sumo the one I was talking about is not far. She’s very attractive, looks like Demi Moore the younger years. What I was trying to say is it would take someone “like Sumo” to tame that one. And as gamer says, too much trouble even if she’s good looking. No offense Sumo! You have the quiet but devious type nature that she needs, but it’s likely too late for her now unless someone has a thing for cute train wrecks!


  126. @ fuzzie true, I agree that she has a good man who she should appreciate rather than pick apart. And yes she should check her own baggage. However as Liz has said every woman be cray cray at one time or another, in one way or another. If a man is going to marry, it’s best if he gets that and acts accordingly. I am not talking about violence. Like again, Liz’s hubby said on no uncertain terms, “this is how it’s going to be.” Elsbeth’s hubby did too. If a man doesn’t set the bar and hold her to it, there will be trouble. It’s true young men are too often being taught to placate and put her on a pedestal. Which leads to…trouble. I am not saying it’s “his fault.” Don’t get me wrong. At this point he’s so tired of her tests he is indifferent, and the dynamic between them is disrespect and contempt. It’s too bad. Even if they stay together, what a miserable way to live. Blech. . .


  127. Sumo says:

    I suppose I shall forgive you, Bloomer.

    Although, I never found Demi Moore to be all that attractive.

    Liked by 2 people

  128. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    I don’t know if it helps but, never mins what they do. It’s what you do that matters.
    On the bright side, you have your BF. I hope that all is well there.

    Liked by 1 person

  129. And yes it’s pur society, the media, the culture. But it has also always been this way. Men never had an idyllic golden age with women who were never trouble. Some women are easier than others for sure, but they are all still “like that” to a degree.

    Liked by 2 people

  130. fuzziewuzziebear says:

    Their marriage is a misery? Uh oh. It may not be salvageable because there are too many bad habits.


  131. @ sumo it really was a compliment, sorry it did not come out that way! And I agree, Demi is not all that! Lol. I meant no harm, certainly not trying to talk any of you into that one! Too much trouble…


  132. Sumo says:

    Bloomer, Bloomer, Bloomer…… yourself mentioned my “devious and less obvious ways”, and yet you still fell for them.

    I guess I’m better at that shit than I thought. 😉

    Liked by 3 people

  133. Lol, see Sumo! I knew you were good. Mind tricks. She’d be no match for you! She’d be fetching your slippers and begging you never to leave in no time!


  134. Spawny Get says:


    get the hubby over to Athol Kay’s site, or at least the old material. I’m no expert of his stuff beyond that last I looked he was advising Ton-light-lite type of stuff. I hear rumours that he more recently discovered that his female audience is where the money is…and may have started to pander to them too much. Someone here probably spent time there. There’s a book (or two) from back in the day

    So, the earlier it was published, the more manosphere approval it probably has

    The essence of his stuff WAS (at least)
    Ton : ‘[What she is doing is one big shit test. It’s what they do.] The husband should fix his shit lose weight etc then tell her to fix her shit or get.
    The ‘big shit test’ is not necessarily concious on her part.

    If you like him enough, maybe buy him a copy anonymously and tell him to read it before thinking about telling seinen echte fuhrerchen about it.

    Liked by 2 people

  135. Spawny Get says:

    Sumo, mad-skillz mate, mad skillz

    Liked by 1 person

  136. SFC Ton says:

    I imagine the golden age of marriage occurred before DV laws.

    Women are basically children so yea Spwany, I doubt most of what they do is a deliberate decision making process. More like an operating program running in the background.

    Liked by 1 person

  137. theasdgamer says:

    All’s fair in love and war. It just isn’t fair that men can treat women with disrespect and still command their love, but women can’t do the same things and still love men.

    If a woman flakes on a man, that is disrespectful and shows that she has a low estimation of his status. End result: the woman falls out of love with the man.

    If a man flakes on a woman, she will have a higher estimation of his status. Did he flake because:

    1) he was seeing another woman (preselection),

    2) he was pursuing his mission and just forgot (DHV),

    3) he can because he has so many options (DHV, preselection)

    End result: the woman still loves the man.


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